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Question Title	Posted By	Question Date
other virgin births?	john	Thursday, December 9, 2004
Question: Hello, I was talking with a new freind the other day and when he found out I was Catholic he really couldnt understand how I could believe what I believe. He braught up that other faiths and civilizations that pre-date Christianity have things like Virgin births,Mother/Son images, Dec 25th festivals etc. He said Christianity is just a spin-off of other ancient beleifs. Can you help me to answer this person or point me in the right direction to answer him? I'm just wondering where he is coming from. I really would like to open up a dialogue about the faith with him. Thanks John E.
Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM Dear John: There are virgin birth myths in antiquity, but the Virgin Birth of Jesus is not a myth. Nevertheless, it is a common debate point among the unenlightened and illogical to suggest that because certain elements of Christianity can be found in pre-Christian religions and philosophies that Christianity is just another spin-off from those notions in antiquity. In a very real sense, and certainly from an ontological point-of-view, nothing pre-dates Christianity. The Church is the pillar and foundation of Truth and NOTHING predates Truth; nothing pre-dates God who IS Truth. Christianity is merely the fullest expression and revelation of God to His children. It is not an off-shoot of anything, it is the "fullest expression" of the Truth that God always was; the "fullest expression" of God's revelation of Himself to his people. Ancient peoples, pagan peoples, peoples of other religions also have a small measure of the revelation of God. The knowledge of God is written on the hearts of all people. Knowledge of God has been revealed to all people through His creation as St. Paul makes clears in Roman 1:19-20 19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. Creation itself testifies to God (the Christian God). No one has an excuse -- not atheist, pagans, anyone. Creation testifies to the existence of God, but does not give the details of God's nature, economy, or salvation plan. Naturally, as God is seen in creation, primitive peoples who do not have the advantage of the revelation given by God to the Jews and to Christians, formed notions about God as best they could and saw God in the Sun and the Moon and in other objects of creation. They mistook creation for the Creator. This is still going on today in the New Age movement, witchcraft, pantheism, etc. These ancient people did the best they could with the knowledge they had about God. As a result tidbits of knowledge emerged that lead these ancient people to develop blood sacrifices, myths of virgin births, and all the variety of images and notions that peak at the truth but that did not come into full understanding until Jesus Christ. These ancient myths and notions and practices are not pre-dating Christianity, they are imperfect precursors and hints of a future understanding God's economy and salvation plan coming into full bloom in Christianity. Bottomline is that there is a connection between those ancient pre-Christian beliefs and Christianity. The connection is the fact and reality that there is one True God who created all things. There is but One Artist who creates with one brush and thus we see Him and His truth in all things. The ancient people got a peak at the brush strokes, but did not really understand them. Thus they formed notions based upon what they imagined given they did not have the fuller knowledge that we do. This explains the similarity. It is not a matter of Christianity as an off-shoot of ancient religions, or of those notions believed by ancient religions evolving into Christianity. It is a matter of ancient peoples trying to understand God (the same God we have as Christians) as best they could and in the process finding tidbits of Truth and little peaks into the nature of God. Those tidbits and peaks were not fully understood or revealed until God revealed Himself more fully to the Jews, and then even fuller still in Christianity. The complete and fullest revelation of God will not be given to us until heaven. None of this will likely convince your friend, but it is not for you to convince him, it is for you to express the truth to him. Plant the seeds of truth and commit him to prayer. Those seeds will hopefully grow and blossom some day, although you may not see the blossoming; it is enough for you to know that you planted the seeds. God Bless, Bro. Ignatius Mary For information on how to receive help see our Help page. We suggest that before contacting us directly for help you try the Seven Steps to Self-Deliverance. These self-help steps will often resolve the problem. Also our Spiritual Warfare Prayer Catalog contains many prayers that may be helpful. If needed you can ask for a Personal Consultation.

Question Title

Posted By

Question Date

other virgin births?

john

Thursday, December 9, 2004

Question:

Hello, I was talking with a new freind the other day and when he found out I was Catholic he really couldnt understand how I could believe what I believe. He braught up that other faiths and civilizations that pre-date Christianity have things like Virgin births,Mother/Son images, Dec 25th festivals etc. He said Christianity is just a spin-off of other ancient beleifs.

Can you help me to answer this person or point me in the right direction to answer him? I'm just wondering where he is coming from. I really would like to open up a dialogue about the faith with him. Thanks John E.

Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OLSM

Dear John:

There are virgin birth myths in antiquity, but the Virgin Birth of Jesus is not a myth.

Nevertheless, it is a common debate point among the unenlightened and illogical to suggest that because certain elements of Christianity can be found in pre-Christian religions and philosophies that Christianity is just another spin-off from those notions in antiquity.

In a very real sense, and certainly from an ontological point-of-view, nothing pre-dates Christianity. The Church is the pillar and foundation of Truth and NOTHING predates Truth; nothing pre-dates God who IS Truth.

Christianity is merely the fullest expression and revelation of God to His children. It is not an off-shoot of anything, it is the "fullest expression" of the Truth that God always was; the "fullest expression" of God's revelation of Himself to his people.

Ancient peoples, pagan peoples, peoples of other religions also have a small measure of the revelation of God. The knowledge of God is written on the hearts of all people. Knowledge of God has been revealed to all people through His creation as St. Paul makes clears in Roman 1:19-20

19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

Creation itself testifies to God (the Christian God). No one has an excuse -- not atheist, pagans, anyone.

Creation testifies to the existence of God, but does not give the details of God's nature, economy, or salvation plan. Naturally, as God is seen in creation, primitive peoples who do not have the advantage of the revelation given by God to the Jews and to Christians, formed notions about God as best they could and saw God in the Sun and the Moon and in other objects of creation. They mistook creation for the Creator. This is still going on today in the New Age movement, witchcraft, pantheism, etc.

These ancient people did the best they could with the knowledge they had about God. As a result tidbits of knowledge emerged that lead these ancient people to develop blood sacrifices, myths of virgin births, and all the variety of images and notions that peak at the truth but that did not come into full understanding until Jesus Christ.

These ancient myths and notions and practices are not pre-dating Christianity, they are imperfect precursors and hints of a future understanding God's economy and salvation plan coming into full bloom in Christianity.

Bottomline is that there is a connection between those ancient pre-Christian beliefs and Christianity. The connection is the fact and reality that there is one True God who created all things. There is but One Artist who creates with one brush and thus we see Him and His truth in all things. The ancient people got a peak at the brush strokes, but did not really understand them. Thus they formed notions based upon what they imagined given they did not have the fuller knowledge that we do. This explains the similarity.

It is not a matter of Christianity as an off-shoot of ancient religions, or of those notions believed by ancient religions evolving into Christianity. It is a matter of ancient peoples trying to understand God (the same God we have as Christians) as best they could and in the process finding tidbits of Truth and little peaks into the nature of God. Those tidbits and peaks were not fully understood or revealed until God revealed Himself more fully to the Jews, and then even fuller still in Christianity. The complete and fullest revelation of God will not be given to us until heaven.

None of this will likely convince your friend, but it is not for you to convince him, it is for you to express the truth to him. Plant the seeds of truth and commit him to prayer. Those seeds will hopefully grow and blossom some day, although you may not see the blossoming; it is enough for you to know that you planted the seeds.

God Bless,
Bro. Ignatius Mary

For information on how to receive help see our Help page. We suggest that before contacting us directly for help you try the Seven Steps to Self-Deliverance. These self-help steps will often resolve the problem. Also our Spiritual Warfare Prayer Catalog contains many prayers that may be helpful. If needed you can ask for a Personal Consultation.