Ask a Question - or - Return to the Faith and Spirituality Forum Index

Question Title	Posted By	Question Date
How would God look upon this do you think?	Anne	Wednesday, June 15, 2016
Question: I worry about my loved ones who have passed away. One of them did not seem to understand much of anything about the Catholic faith, even though he was raised Catholic. He once said "You don't really have to go to Sunday Mass; you can get it on TV." Then he proceeded to say, buy a bottle of wine and get some hosts at the religious goods store, and while watching the Mass on TV, when it comes to Communion, use the hosts you got at the store." He was serious! I tried to tell him it doesn't work that way. His sister, who was years older than he was, also had issues. She didn't know if she was baptized and so she was baptized at the age of 10 or so just in case she wasn't. The mother was uneducated, an orphan, who married very young and had her daughter at age 15. Her knowledge of the church was minimal if not altogether lacking. In those days, the records were not kept like they are now. (She was born in 1900, and had her first baby in 1915.) So my question is how does God deal with such people when they die? I am not sure the mother could read or not. She worked as a housemaid, I think, and maybe in a factory, I don't know for sure. She had run away from an orphanage up in Ontario, Canada, when she was 9 and no one tried to find her.
Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OMSM(r), LTh, DD Dear Anne: God is merciful and loving. His justice is perfect. He knows the hearts of His children. The hearts of those who are genuinely ignorant of the Faith, called invisible ignorance, may still go to heaven even if, in their ignorance they commit a grave sin. As for this mother's children, the man and the sister you mention, a similar situation applies. While not going to Mass is a grace sin, this man may have simply misunderstood the requirement for Mass because of the ignorance of his mother and other factors that keep him ignorant into adulthood. We can hope for their salvation because of this ignorance of your loved ones. The Church teaches that in order for a grave sin to be mortal the person must know that it is mortal and must freely choose, without any impairment to their ability to understand and to decide, to commit the sin anyway. I would say that in the case of your loved ones, there could be a case not only of ignorance of the gravity of the sin, but also an impairment to freely choose. But, only God knows for sure. The Church teaching from the Catechism... 1859 Mortal sin requires full knowledge and complete consent. It presupposes knowledge of the sinful character of the act, of its opposition to God's law. It also implies a consent sufficiently deliberate to be a personal choice. Feigned ignorance and hardness of heart133 do not diminish, but rather increase, the voluntary character of a sin. 1860 Unintentional ignorance can diminish or even remove the imputability of a grave offense. But no one is deemed to be ignorant of the principles of the moral law, which are written in the conscience of every man. The promptings of feelings and passions can also diminish the voluntary and free character of the offense, as can external pressures or pathological disorders. Sin committed through malice, by deliberate choice of evil, is the gravest. 1735 Imputability and responsibility for an action can be diminished or even nullified by ignorance, inadvertence, duress, fear, habit, inordinate attachments, and other psychological or social factors. Again, only God knows for sure, but the Catechism does give three examples where this "diminished responsibility" may occur: 1) in some cases of prostitution (CCC 2355) 2) in some cases of those who grew up atheist (CCC 2125) 3) in some cases of those in serious habit or addiction to pornography (CCC 2352b) What all this means, is that we can always have hope for our loved ones even if they lived in sin. No one trips into hell. No one is there by mistake. It takes a deliberate, knowing, and unimpaired choice (unimpaired by ignorance, inadvertence, duress, fear, habit, inordinate attachments, and other psychological or social factors) to reject God's grace to find oneself in hell. God know where the lines are draw. He knows the hearts Have hope. God Bless, Bro. Ignatius Mary Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below: Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum. Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum

Question Title

Posted By

Question Date

How would God look upon this do you think?

Anne

Wednesday, June 15, 2016

Question:

I worry about my loved ones who have passed away. One of them did not seem to understand much of anything about the Catholic faith, even though he was raised Catholic. He once said "You don't really have to go to Sunday Mass; you can get it on TV." Then he proceeded to say, buy a bottle of wine and get some hosts at the religious goods store, and while watching the Mass on TV, when it comes to Communion, use the hosts you got at the store." He was serious!

I tried to tell him it doesn't work that way. His sister, who was years older than he was, also had issues. She didn't know if she was baptized and so she was baptized at the age of 10 or so just in case she wasn't.

The mother was uneducated, an orphan, who married very young and had her daughter at age 15. Her knowledge of the church was minimal if not altogether lacking. In those days, the records were not kept like they are now. (She was born in 1900, and had her first baby in 1915.)

So my question is how does God deal with such people when they die? I am not sure the mother could read or not. She worked as a housemaid, I think, and maybe in a factory, I don't know for sure. She had run away from an orphanage up in Ontario, Canada, when she was 9 and no one tried to find her.

Question Answered by Bro. Ignatius Mary, OMSM(r), LTh, DD

Dear Anne:

God is merciful and loving. His justice is perfect. He knows the hearts of His children. The hearts of those who are genuinely ignorant of the Faith, called invisible ignorance, may still go to heaven even if, in their ignorance they commit a grave sin.

As for this mother's children, the man and the sister you mention, a similar situation applies. While not going to Mass is a grace sin, this man may have simply misunderstood the requirement for Mass because of the ignorance of his mother and other factors that keep him ignorant into adulthood.

We can hope for their salvation because of this ignorance of your loved ones. The Church teaches that in order for a grave sin to be mortal the person must know that it is mortal and must freely choose, without any impairment to their ability to understand and to decide, to commit the sin anyway.

I would say that in the case of your loved ones, there could be a case not only of ignorance of the gravity of the sin, but also an impairment to freely choose. But, only God knows for sure.

The Church teaching from the Catechism...

1859 Mortal sin requires full knowledge and complete consent. It presupposes knowledge of the sinful character of the act, of its opposition to God's law. It also implies a consent sufficiently deliberate to be a personal choice. Feigned ignorance and hardness of heart133 do not diminish, but rather increase, the voluntary character of a sin.

1860 Unintentional ignorance can diminish or even remove the imputability of a grave offense. But no one is deemed to be ignorant of the principles of the moral law, which are written in the conscience of every man. The promptings of feelings and passions can also diminish the voluntary and free character of the offense, as can external pressures or pathological disorders. Sin committed through malice, by deliberate choice of evil, is the gravest.

1735 Imputability and responsibility for an action can be diminished or even nullified by ignorance, inadvertence, duress, fear, habit, inordinate attachments, and other psychological or social factors.

Again, only God knows for sure, but the Catechism does give three examples where this "diminished responsibility" may occur:

1) in some cases of prostitution (CCC 2355)
2) in some cases of those who grew up atheist (CCC 2125)
3) in some cases of those in serious habit or addiction to pornography (CCC 2352b)

What all this means, is that we can always have hope for our loved ones even if they lived in sin.

No one trips into hell. No one is there by mistake. It takes a deliberate, knowing, and unimpaired choice (unimpaired by ignorance, inadvertence, duress, fear, habit, inordinate attachments, and other psychological or social factors) to reject God's grace to find oneself in hell. God know where the lines are draw. He knows the hearts

Have hope.

God Bless,
Bro. Ignatius Mary

Footer Notes: This forum is for general questions on the faith. See specific Topic Forums below:
Spiritual Warfare, demons, the occult go to our Spiritul Warfare Q&S Forum.
Liturgy Questions go to our Liturgy and Liturgical Law Q&A Forum
Liturgy of the Hours (Divine Office) Questions go to our Divine Office Q&A Forum
Defenfing the Faith Questions go to our Defending the Faith Q&A Forum
Church History Questions go to our Church History Q&A Forum